Which sort of sparrow is this (assuming it actually is one)

[ExtraMedium]

I've never seen one like this before.:)

And this within an hour of putting out my very first CJ Defender with guardian; could just be a coincidence I suppose.;)

Since colour is normally what is used to identify, I'm a little stumped by this cute little item.:eek:

Cheers,
Ian

[PiratesAhoy!]

Now that really *is* strange. It looks like a house sparrow with albinism. Wouldn't like to say for sure, but can't think of anything else it could be!

[ExtraMedium]

Now that really *is* strange. It looks like a house sparrow with albinism. Wouldn't like to say for sure, but can't think of anything else it could be!
Thanks very much for the second opinion!

First spotted this, or one very much like it, about a month back, however my memory of it was of being larger than this time, and a bit more golden.

I had another glimpse today and this time it seemed that the beak was much more yellow. But it was more golden too, could be I got two of them. [edit, it seemed a bit smaller today too, hence why I think this one is perhaps not alone]

I saw a pic on a google search, and it was of a white sparrow. and it really was white too, and the beak on that was definitely yellow. Apparently they get them in Russia, and they call the white ones Dukes. They consider them to be magic birds, and they make a wish, the legend says that it often comes true within a very short space of time! It's really not like me to go in for that sort of thing, but I did anyway! :) (gift horse, mouth, etc.)

It's not white enough to call it a Duke, so maybe it's just an Earl or Barron something?! ;)

It's not the best set of pics in the world as it's a very fast moving bird, and the light has been pretty poor every time I've seen it. I'm just glad to have any pics at all of it. I surely had no time to reach for the teleconverter having missed it once already due to that, and been kicking myself ever since! However I may risk it if there is a next time, as at least I have some pics now!

How could I get the species confirmed? I'd really like to know for sure what on earth I've got here!

[PiratesAhoy!]

I agree, it's not *quite* white enough to be a "white sparrow". I don't even know if they're a recognised sub-species or not. In any case they're quite rare. Here's a good example of them: http://www.babinets.com/minsk-photo-blog-pictures-1206.html

Some birds do suffer from partial albinism though - notably blackbirds. (an example (http://www.birdsofbritain.co.uk/img.asp?i=photos/gallery/gallery-05-04/albino-blackbird-th.jpg)). Sparrow albinism is rarer, but is far more likely than seeing a white sparrow in Buckinghamshire! :)

Good examples of partial albinism:
http://wquinn.tripod.com/albinosparrow.jpg
http://www.keycreations.com/~rmangile/BulBoard/Albino%20Sparrow%205.jpg
http://www.ohiobirds.org/birdingnews/images/albino1%20Cardington%20Terry%20Wheat%20082706.jpg

Interestingly, there are quite a few taxidermied pied and albino specimens (and 'flavistic' (golden) specimens) on display at Rothschild Zoological Museum, Tring. Seems that this was a popular ending for albino species discovered in the 19th century.

[ExtraMedium]

Thanks again, some I've seen while trawling, others not.

The last one shows what I was looking for, pink eyes, that's a full on albino trait according to quite a few sources, as are the pink legs.

My little chap does not have them!

I'm chuffed, it's fully odd :D and I've seen no other pics like it yet.

[Lisa]

Hi

This is an interesting one. I have asked some of our resident experts to have a look.

They said that the colours and markings did initially appear to be similar to a sparrow, however the bill is too short.

I have asked a couple of people who know their birds to have a look and the consensus is that this is a Chaffinch.

Partial aberrations are always a challenge but the structure of the bird along with the white on the tail and wing are very suggestive of Chaffinch.

I am assuming that this picture was taken in the UK?? If it were taken abroad this could explain why it is difficult to identify.

Hope this helps

[ExtraMedium]

Yes, in Buckinghamshire, in our back garden. It was feeding along with a bunch of sparrows, and most often is. I agree the bill does seem rather finch like, but didn't feel confident that I was right about it, as I'm not what you'd call experienced in these things.

I'm really warming to this little one. It's quite possible it's not alone too; as sometimes it seems to get smaller!;)

Not spotted today, seems to stay out of the way when it's brighter, and being that colour I can easily imagine why you'd want to stay out of sight, there can't be too many places you could call safe if you're as easy to spot as this one is.

[Georgieone]

It's fascinating EM - can you put any more photo's up please?

[ExtraMedium]

Yes, of course, but the forum software has already complained about me uploading too many pictures, even when I had not uploaded any, so I have put them in my web album here (http://s163.photobucket.com/albums/t320/Extra_Medium/2007/06/). I just hope that isn't too many links now!;)

I've arranged that some better views in different respects might give someone more to to work with.

I dropped a certain TV programme a line about it, (which we are no longer meant to mention, but so you can guess which one I might mean, it is (as I type) in between it's second and third week for this year) and so far that has met with complete disinterest; which seems a bit odd as, if it wasn't for them and something they featured in a previous year, I would have almost certainly never have taken these shots at all.:)

[ExtraMedium]

I found this (http://www.bbc.co.uk/wales/nature/sites/features/pages/questions_answers.shtml) at the BBC.

It's not quite the same, but enough that I am happy they must be quite similar.

Our one (or others that there still could be) is more mottled and not so much in the direction of pinkish, but I think it's in the right direction. I guess golden and pinkish could look similar in not too wonderful light, which might explain some of the other features I've glimpsed.

Once you are talking mutant, then I don't think there can be too many strict rules!:D

I could still be wrong, of course, but this looks about right I'd have to guess. If anyone does have a better idea I am all ears, as I have much learning to do.

Well, that my wish gone for a Burton I suspect!;)

[barn owl]

hi all,
is it possible that this is an albino twite ? the same bars of white on wings and tail same beak, i must admit there are some strange birdies about these days, i had a blackbird here the other day with what can only be described as wearing a skirt lol. the feathers below the wings were all fluffed out wish i had my camera at the time he/she has not returned,
regards owl.

[ExtraMedium]

I've just been for a browse, and yes, it does have some features in common with a twite. Beak and tail feathers are quite similar in many ways.

It's not playing fair at all is it?:)

Thanks very much for the pointer, I'd not heard of them before. I'm getting a crash course in identifying the many various different makes of bird people!:)

[barn owl]

Hi Ian,
well we all learn something daily about our feathered friends, maybe i am wrong, but i saw one once as a kid now im old as dirt but still learning, however what you have is very special there. i talked about my blackbird out it seemed for a sat night dirty dancing hehe, and today i read about the parrots in gandolphs hmmmm (spelling) garden. a lady here has seen a hoopoo, and a moth mixed up with a humming bird has been seen, special moments are rare, i saw a grass snake trying to eat a toad so big there was no way he could swallow it.a black cat in mid wales in day light, too big to be domestic. what you have is on camera and well done for that, i hope you find out what it is.
regards owl.

[Margaret]

Hi EM,

I've been following this thread with interest and admiring your photos, I don't wish to muddy the waters and am quite willing to be shot down in flames - but, it's not possibly a Snow Bunting is it? In my 'Bible' there is a picture of one on the same page as the Twite and at first I matched up the wrong pictures. Apparently although the Snow Bunting nests in the far north they do sometimes venture further south into Lancashire, a long way from you I know but could it have been blown off course?!:confused:

[ExtraMedium]

Yes, I can see where snow bunting might figure now I've had a good look at some pics, however I think the legs are wrong for them, but then again, I've no real experience anyway. The beak sure looks right, the problem is the feathers of the snow bunting appear to have pale edges, and they are really quite pronounced, and of course this item has a bit of an issue with being the right colour, what ever colour it's meant to be! Delightful little puzzle this creature presents!

Not seen today either, weather was a little brighter. It'll be interesting over time to see if it really does only show up in lower light.

[edit]Actually, those pale edges of the feather do strongly suggest there's a bit of Snow Bunting about it, but in Buckinghamshire? It's a heck of a long way out of bounds. Could it be that this bird is some sort of weird hybrid? And hence all the fun and game trying to figure it out, I mean if it is more than one sort, then it's going to prove next door to impossible to get a real grip on it. I saw a pic of a half duck half goose a few weeks ago, and that was pretty easy to see what had happened (poor creature had the worse of both worlds, not even both parts of the bill matched, short upper and long lower), but this is harder to appreciate which species might be involved as it could be two that are quite a lot closer to start with at a guess.

[PiratesAhoy!]

The white bars on the tail and the 'finchy' beak do tend to point towards the chaffinch, so that's a good suggestion - thanks Lisa!

[70007]

Hi Ian,
and a moth mixed up with a humming bird has been seen,

That would be a Hummingbird Hawkmoth. They are quite common in July and August, and migrate here from mainland Europe, which I always find amazing. Such a small creature can fly all that way over the sea. Many other moths and butterflies migrate as well, and in certain hot summers they come over in their thousands.

[ExtraMedium]

Thanks Barn Owl, and in fact everyone.

I don't think we'll ever figure it out for sure, but it's been fun trying and pretty informative too.

I'm happy enough to let it linger on as it's still a cute little item, whatever it actually is!:) Here's to more mystery birds!;):cool:

[Georgieone]

EM - It certainly is a "Cute little Mystery" but interesting.

[Keljem]

Great photo, thanks for showing it.

Gz

[ExtraMedium]

Most welcome. it's a fun thing to see.:)



Well, look who's back now they've grown a little more!

Better pic this time too. I'm now leaning back towards the view that this is a partial albino sparrow myself.

It's always with sparrows, seems to have a lighter than normal sister around sometimes and is part of a group of 4 or maybe 5 that act like a sparrow family, indeed this one behaves like a sparrow in general. I'm just really glad it seems to be surviving.

[ExtraMedium]

Just realised, I should have bumped this instead of just editing! Otherwise how would anyone know I updated it with the new and better picture? I can be such a buffoon at times!;)

Seeing "blondie" (as I have nicknamed it) nearly every day now.:)

[Gandalf]

"Seeing "blondie" (as I have nicknamed it) nearly every day now."

Certainly seems to be thriving now. Have you submitted the image to any of the online birding communities? You should be able to get a positive ID. Certainly does look like a Sparrow of sorts.

Cheers

[Georgieone]

I am finding this very interesting - do please post some more and let us know if you do find out it's official origen.

[PiratesAhoy!]

The 'eyelashes' (for want of a better expression) do seem to indicate a sparrow, now that we have a different photo.

Frankly I'm amazed it's with other sparrows - most albinos are cast out or deliberately killed. Nature is often cruel like that.

Hope the little chap continues to do well :)

[ExtraMedium]

The 'eyelashes' (for want of a better expression) do seem to indicate a sparrow, now that we have a different photo.

Frankly I'm amazed it's with other sparrows - most albinos are cast out or deliberately killed. Nature is often cruel like that.

Hope the little chap continues to do well :)

Well here's another shot, this time with most of the family, all offspring on left and mum on right. Dad has a taste for the other feeder with different seeds in it and for fatballs, he was busy with that lot at this time! Note the somewhat lighter colouring of the female at the rear on the left. All the offspring seem to have kept their much pinker than what seemes to be usual leg colour too. Most others of about this age have had that go darker more or less like mum on the right.

I could be wrong but mum and dad look like they are going for another nest now too! We are knee deep in sparrows here I am happy to report.

[sallyh]

Fascinating & such great photos, thank you.

[dozzie]

This albino finch type bird has started feeding in my garden, does anyone has more info...

[70007]

This albino finch type bird has started feeding in my garden, does anyone has more info...

It looks like a house sparrow to me, but it may be a chaffinch. I had better leave it to the experts.

I have never seen a completely albino bird like that.

[Georgieone]

I've never seen one like that either - wish I had though.

[PiratesAhoy!]

Its beak is too 'thick' to be a sparrow I think. I reckon its either a chaffinch or a greenfinch.

If I had to choose, I'd say a greenfinch with almost total albinism.

[Maisie]

I'd go for "green"finch too.