young robin

[keelo44]

Hi All,
This little robin has lost both its parents to sparrow hawks, and the rest of his brothers and sisters to cats on Saturday 12 June, we have been giving him dried meal worms ( soaked in warm water), he cant yet fly upwards, although he does jump off the sofa, and flaps his tiny wings, we have to put the meal worms into his mouth when he squawks, otherwise he just sits there, can any of you tell me if he will learn to feed himself as he gets older
Steve

[PiratesAhoy!]

Yes he will, but robins get a little 'awkward' as they begin to wean. We had one this year that just went downhill one night during the weaning period and just died overnight.

Diet is tricky to get right on robins. If you can, use live mealworms, but chop the heads off before feeding (bit grim, I know).

If not, an alternative is puppy food. I use Pedigree puppy food, chicken flavour usually, tiny bits, and moisten every 3rd of 4th bit.

Another alternative is Royal Canin dog biscuits. "Medium mature" variety, soaked for about 4-6 hours in water until soft. Feed small bits to the robin/blackbird/etc. They're very high in animal proteins which is mostly what a young bird requires.

Scrambled egg is also very good as a supplement.

If this is all a bit much, and you're not sure how he'll get on when he starts to feed himself, then the alternative is to take him to a wildlife centre. See this list:

http://britishwildlifehelpline.com/Centres%20_%20England.html

One of the best in your area is Lower Moss Wood in Knutsford (01565 755082)

There's also one in Bolton - Horwich - 01204 690018 - but I've no experience of them directly.

Feel free to PM me. I'm a little further down in Cheshire than Knutsford, so futher away from you.

[crissie]

hi piratesahoy,
You have given a mountain of info as usual, thanks.
Can i just ask why the meal worms heads have to be cut off? I think i remember reading that the blue tits bite the head off before giving to chicks but I just wondered why.
If you have time to answer I would be grateful.

[PiratesAhoy!]

Basically to kill the mealworm.

There have been all manner of scare stories about mealworms (possibly worms in general) surviving being eaten, then trying to eat their way back out again. I'm not sure how true that is, but the wild parent birds do it, so I replicate the behaviour.

[crissie]

I see thanks, yes I have heard these stories too and from my research there is no truth in them at all, meal worms are vegetarians any way so i can't see them wanting to munch there way through a birds gut. :eek:
Thanks for the reply, My robins seem to get two or three in the beak and then knock them on the bird table or fence a few times, we thought perhaps stun them so they wouldn't try wriggling on the flight back to the nest, I'm thinking now this quick bashing might even be to kill them.

Any update on this little robin Keelo?

[keelo44]

Hi Crisse,
This little chap is doing fine, I got a small tub of live meal worms and put them into boiling water just to be sure. I am going to give him some puppy food tomorrow....... Steve

[PiratesAhoy!]

I see thanks, yes I have heard these stories too and from my research there is no truth in them at all, meal worms are vegetarians any way so i can't see them wanting to munch there way through a birds gut. :eek:

I agree - I don't think there's a lot of truth in the old myth. It's probably more like having a live mealworm inside you would feel weird and uncomfortable - hence the stunning/killing. Must be a logical reason for it somewhere anyway.

Good news on the little fellow Steve, I hope he continues to thrive :)

[crissie]

Hi Keelo44, thats great news, please keep us updated and include some delevopement pics if you can, thanks.

[keelo44]

Hi Crissie,
These are two pics i took of the robin this morning
Steve

[PiratesAhoy!]

Sweet :)

He's looking quite bright and alert, which is good news. At this point, the tail will indicate readiness to wean. When it gets to about 2/3 inches long, he'll probably start looking to eat for himself. All his head fuzz will have gone too, and he'll almost be ready to fend for himself in the world.

[crissie]

He looks fab, thanks for posting the pics, very cute too.

This is a silly question but I'll ask anyway cos I want to know.....
Where does one release the birds that they have rescued, would it be into the garden if the garden is reasonably safe or do you go out and about to find a nice tranquil area.

[keelo44]

The baby robin has now started to take food off my finger, even picks it up if he drops it, we are going to leave him out of his box at night now, and will keep him for another week, then hopefully next Saturday morning will release him into the garden, its been very warm in the living room due to us not being able to open the patio doors, we have had to have a fan on these last two days
... Steve...

[crissie]

you've done really well haven't you.
Great stuff! :)

[PiratesAhoy!]

Great stuff Steve!

As far as releasing goes, we've always tried to release them in our back/front garden. A while back we just used to open the window of 'the bird room', when they were all being raised in there, and they'd fly out when they were ready.

These days, we have a number of aviaries out in the back garden, and we release stuff from there. Generally we give them their morning food, then leave the door or roof open, and when they're ready, they fly off of their own will - a 'soft release'.

Taking a bird somewhere else to release can be problematic. I suppose it depends on the bird, and how well you know the release site - for predators, cover, etc.

Also, I guess we like the peace of mind of being able to check up on the releases, as much as practical. We let a baby blackbird go a few weeks back, and he's been seen a number of times, so we know he's done ok.

[keelo44]

Hi all,
We were going to let the robin fly into the garden today, but we are not sure he is quite ready to go yet, he will take food off the floor by himself, and take live meal worms and maggots, but not often enough, sometimes he just sits there squawking wanting to be fed, ive enclosed shots of our garden were we hope he will take up residence once he has been released
... Steve...

[keelo44]

Hi All,
The baby robin that we have has started to refuse to eat by itself, preferring to be fed by myself, and my mrs, we have even left him for a couple of hours with meal worms, but he just leaves them until we enter the room, then he flies over to us, would it be cruel if we let him go this weekend
... Steve...

[PiratesAhoy!]

If he's not reliably eating for himself, then yes it would be cruel to release him.

Perhaps what he needs is a more varied diet.

At this stage though, it may be best to get him to a wildlife rehab centre. They may be able to put him in a release aviary with robins and other small passerines and release them all when they're ready.

I'm just a bit worried that if you don't do this, the robin is just going to remain reliant on you for food. He won't survive in the wild like that.

I find myself with a similar bird at the moment. We have been brought a crow that's been hand-reared (by an unknown person), and almost refuses to eat unless the food is shovelled down his throat. He needs to go into an aviary with other crows (which we have here), but until he breaks his bond with hand-feeding, he won't do well, even in the aviary. He'll probably either beg the other crows to feed him (which they won't) or wait to be fed, and the others will eat all of his food. Basically he's pathetic, and will be bullied away from any food source. A wild bird has to be able to compete for food, not simply wait around until it's brought to them.

So, long story short, I've been cutting down the amount that I hand feed him. At first, it was every hour or 2, then after a while perhaps 3 times a day. Now only once a day, and he's starting to eat for himself, especially while I'm out of the room. He still begs, but I have to ignore him (he's very loud!), and I still have to go in there a couple of times a day to clean his cage (crows are VERY messy in cages).

It's tough to do, but it has to be done. When I feel I don't need to hand-feed him any more, I'll put him in with other crows. Hopefully he'll learn off them and become a bit wilder, ready for his eventual release in late summer.

[keelo44]

Hi,
I am going up to the local pet shop to see what other live food i can get, i have uploaded a 20 second video of the robin on Youtube.( I hope,because ive never used the site before).........Steve...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kjXFRgQJrUs

[PiratesAhoy!]

Robins will eat other things aside from live food. Get some bird seed and offer that to him. Additionally, see if the pet shop has anything called 'insectivorous' - brand names like Bogena, Witte/Molen, Bill Oddie, etc. It might also be called 'songbird mix', or 'blackbird mix', or similar. This is good stuff for Robins - contains freeze dried insects, grain, some fruit and baker's products.

Like all young creatures, the food will be experimented with, so some of the it will end up on the floor, walls, etc :)

[PiratesAhoy!]

I find myself with a similar bird at the moment. We have been brought a crow that's been hand-reared (by an unknown person), and almost refuses to eat unless the food is shovelled down his throat. He needs to go into an aviary with other crows (which we have here), but until he breaks his bond with hand-feeding, he won't do well, even in the aviary. He'll probably either beg the other crows to feed him (which they won't) or wait to be fed, and the others will eat all of his food. Basically he's pathetic, and will be bullied away from any food source. A wild bird has to be able to compete for food, not simply wait around until it's brought to them.

So, long story short, I've been cutting down the amount that I hand feed him. At first, it was every hour or 2, then after a while perhaps 3 times a day. Now only once a day, and he's starting to eat for himself, especially while I'm out of the room. He still begs, but I have to ignore him (he's very loud!), and I still have to go in there a couple of times a day to clean his cage (crows are VERY messy in cages).

I made a video of aforementioned crow - he's still not comfortably eating for himself, as you'll see!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hknyLk9fzXU

[Nature__Lover]

in the video the little robin looks very bright alert, and certainly darts about , doesn't he!?
But if he is not eating by himself in a few weeks, he probably has to be sent to a wildlife rehab centre.

In the wild, a robin will usually eat any little creatures they can get their hands on, and seeds from peoples feeders. Try feeding it plenty of live food to get him used to it, but also some good quality seed mixes. I bought a bag of Bill Oddie summer mix, which has no fillers or dog food in it (believe it or not some do) it instead has dried mealworms, fruit, and sunflower hearts.

Please keep us posted on how he's doing, and please don't release him until he can easily get food for himself!

[Nature__Lover]

oh and I just thought.... in the wild.. would the parents still be feeding him?
maybe he wouldn't have learnt yet in the wild?
if you know how old he is, try looking on the internet to see if they would be eating by themselves in the wild at that age.

[keelo44]

Hi All,
The robin flew out on his own, he was feeding and drinking on his own, have not seen him in the garden, and he's been gone 2 weeks, both his parents fell victim to sparrow hawks, maybe he will return when he develops his adult plumage, in the meantime i am now getting rid of all the cats that frequent my garden
Steve

[PiratesAhoy!]

Hi Steve,

Good to hear the robin did so well - thank you for looking after him :)

[Nature__Lover]

Well done!
I hope he does well :) when you see robins in your garden with their new autumn coats on , I bet you'll always wonder if it's him :)



and about what was being discussed before--i've heard that if you feed them live maggots (which some people do)
they could eat away at the bird. But ..mealworms? never heard of them doing it, especially since they don't eat meat, and they are being fed to hundreds of birds all the time!